[thwapy]

Hi.

I am looking at buying a new computer and have been really tempted by a Dell... I cannot get near the price with any other company for the spec I can get from them:

At the moment we only have a laptop in the house, with a 12 GB hard drive and 224MB RAM so as you can imagine, its quite frustrating trying to do anything. I have to have a external drive just to cope with our itunes !

We will mainly use the computer for surfing the net and entertainment, watching dvd's etc. Perhaps some gaming but only older less powerful games.

Could I have some comments on the spec below. Especially the graphics card, is it worth paying an extra £53 for a:

256MB ATI® Radeon® X1300 Pro PCI Express graphics card

Is it a good card or do I stick with the basic card and upgrade when I can afford it for something else?

Also the new Vista operating system, is it any good? I've heard its power hungry hence going for 2gb ram...

The TV card option is £60 extra, would it be easy for me to fit my own, as you can pick them up for much less. And also a wireless card, easy to fit?

Any other advice would be greatly appreciated, sorry its such a long winded thread! Cheers.

SPEC:
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo E4300 Processor (1.80GHz,1066MHz,2MB cache)

Genuine Windows Vistaâ„¢ Home Premium - English

Collect & Return, 1 Year Service only

Dellâ„¢ 22" Black Wide Flat Panel (E228WFP) - UK/Irish

2048MB 533MHz Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM [2x1024]

250GB (7200rpm) Serial ATA Hard Drive with 8MB DataBurstâ„¢ cache

Integrated Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 3000

16X DVD+/-RW Drive

Dellâ„¢ Entry Quietkey USB Keyboard - UK/Irish (QWERTY)

Dell 2 Button USB Scroll Optical Mouse - Black


AccessoriesIntegrated Audio with Dolby Digital 7.1 capability

No Speakers

No Floppy Drive

No Modem

[alex]

Firstly, welcome to the forum Thwapy.

If buying a base specification pc from Dell they tend to be very competitive price wise. But when you start to upgrade components they do sting you on price.

Take the X1300 you've quoted. It's 53.00 more than the integrated chipset they quoted on the base spec. X1300's cost, by themselves, 35.00 for the 256mb version or 55.00 for the 512mb version. The 512mb ram on the second version is wasted to be frank because the X1300 is a very weak card and won't be able to game above 1280x1024, and you don't need more than 256mb ram at that resolution or for textures when gaming at that resolution. Throwing 512mb ram on a card (half of which will never be used) is simply a marketing ploy as people will see the bigger number and assume it's a better card.

You're absolutely correct about Vista being a resource hog, and going for 2gb ram is the minimum amount I would recommend. So good choice there.

Good choice also on the Core2, but you could get the E6400 or E6420 specced on a system from another builder for not much more. Last time I looked Dell were asking nearly 40.00 for this upgrade, which is a ludicrous price increase. Also (regarding your quote below) E4300's don't have a 1066mhz FSB, they have a 800mhz FSB. So Dell are misquoting the actual speed of the cpu there (if you've just copied and paste that info). If so, doesn't make you very confident does it?

As the tft you've quoted has a resolution of 1680x1050, and you intend to do some gaming, I'd highly recommend a more powerful graphics solution than the x1300. Even for older games. To give me a clearer indication, what games do you play?

Yup, pc expansion cards (tv, sound etc) tend to be rather easy to fit, even for a first timer.

All in all, it's quite a balanced system spec.

When you say other builders can't touch the Dell where have you looked?

Lastly, whats your budget? Let me have a nosey around for you if you want.

[thwapy]

Hi Alex

Can I say thank you first off for such a helpful reply.

Our budget is around £450, the quote from dell, which I did indeed 'cut & paste', worked out at £464.18 with the integrated card and £517.05 with the X1300. Well spotted on the fact they had misquoted the speed of the CPU, I did not know this!? Not brilliant as you said.

I have seen that Dell Monitors are well thought of and as I think I put earlier, we intend to use the computer in our bedroom, so it would be nice for the monitor to double up as our telly.

However I have convinced the missus to nip to pc world with me to have a look at sizes this afternoon, as I'm not sure there is much difference between 19 & 22 inches and it would save us another £88.....

I have no idea what games I would play, I'm an xbox boy(sorry) so it would be my first real venture into PC gaming, since playing Swat 3 to death on my Pentium many years ago!!!

The buy now, pay november was also a pull, but if you found us something better that would not matter really.

As for looking around, I just google'd a few sites and compared the spec from Dell with their quotes.

Many thanks again.

Jay

[alex]

Can I say thank you first off for such a helpful reply. No problem, what i'm here for.

Our budget is around £450, the quote from dell, which I did indeed 'cut & paste', worked out at £464.18 with the integrated card and £517.05 with the X1300. Well spotted on the fact they had misquoted the speed of the CPU, I did not know this!? Not brilliant as you said.

I have seen that Dell Monitors are well thought of and as I think I put earlier, we intend to use the computer in our bedroom, so it would be nice for the monitor to double up as our telly. Dell's monitors are basically second to none on a bang for buck basis. They're LG's just re-badged as Dell's.

However I have convinced the missus to nip to pc world with me to have a look at sizes this afternoon, as I'm not sure there is much difference between 19 & 22 inches and it would save us another £88..... There is a noticeable difference in veiwing area, especially since the 22" tft your quoted is a widescreen.

I have no idea what games I would play, I'm an xbox boy(sorry) so it would be my first real venture into PC gaming, since playing Swat 3 to death on my Pentium many years ago!!! Don't apologise for being an xbox fan. Infact: Kudos! (me too by the way, I'm still playing Halo). So if i'm reading this correctly, you're not a games player per se, but given the opportunity with this new pc you may have a dabble?

The buy now, pay november was also a pull, but if you found us something better that would not matter really. I'll have a nosey around, it may take a couple of days due to other committments, but if you could bear with me that would be appreciated. If anything, it'll show whether or not the Dell price, overall, is a good one.

As for looking around, I just google'd a few sites and compared the spec from Dell with their quotes.

Many thanks again. You're welcome.

[thwapy]

Hi Alex

We nipped to pc world this afternoon and your right, the 22" monitor is far better than the 19". So that's a must in the spec....

I have had a look on a few websites I have seen that you have recommended in the past. Komplett and MESH etc. I cannot get anywhere near the DELL spec with a 22" monitor for that kind of money.

I think we will go for the DELL E520, with the spec above, except we will go for the integrated graphics card and I will buy a card based on your (forums) recommendations and upgrade as soon as we can afford to?

However we are not planning on buying the computer until tomorrow, so if you have any more excellent advice before then, that would be great!

Your comments have been really valuable and I really appreciate your help. Advice on a good (cheap) wireless card, TV card, a graphics card and speakers, would be great mate!

[alex]

Originally Posted by thwapy

Hi Alex

We nipped to pc world this afternoon and your right, the 22" monitor is far better than the 19". So that's a must in the spec....

I have had a look on a few websites I have seen that you have recommended in the past. Komplett and MESH etc. I cannot get anywhere near the DELL spec with a 22" monitor for that kind of money.

I think we will go for the DELL E520, with the spec above, except we will go for the integrated graphics card and I will buy a card based on your (forums) recommendations and upgrade as soon as we can afford to?

However we are not planning on buying the computer until tomorrow, so if you have any more excellent advice before then, that would be great!

Your comments have been really valuable and I really appreciate your help. Advice on a good (cheap) wireless card, TV card, a graphics card and speakers, would be great mate!

For a good and cheap wireless network card I'd go for the Linksys WMP54G Wireless-G PCI Adapter. It should cost you around £15.

For the graphics card, and considering your o.s is Vista, I'd go for a Nvidia 8600GT. This will give you full DX10 gaming access should you need it. And as i guess you'll have this pc for some time, future proofing is never a bad thing.

But keep an eye out on Ati's HD2*** series of cards (if not buying yet) because they've just been released and you should see prices dropping as Nvidia and ATI compete with each other through re-sellers.

One last thing regarding the card though, before purchase find out what power the card needs (in watts) from the makers/re-sellers website because you may need to upgrade your psu to a more powerful model.

For a tv card I'd go for any of the Hauppauge series. Which one is upto you dependent on your requirements. They start from around £90 for the digital & analogue ones.

If you are planning on recording a lot of tv, I'd also seriously think about an external hdd purely for this storage. A 320gb should do you nicely, as it will also suffice for backup's.

Couldn't agree more on the 22", once you've seen one next to a 19" its no contest (from that point of view).

And, again, its no problem. If you have any further questions/worries/doubts etc then feel free to post back.

[thwapy]

Just a couple more points Alex, if you don't mind !

Firstly, do I really have to pay all that for a tv card, I just want something we can plug the sky+ into, do I need one that does more than that? I trust your judgement. And as we have Sky + we don't need to record tv. Maybe something around the £20 mark !!

More importantly will the 'intergrated' graphics card do for now or do we really need to upgrade immediately?

Cheers Alex

Jay

PS Anyone else want to join in the conversation ;-)

[alex]

No, you're not forced to pay all that for a tv card. Again, it depends on your needs.

Best bet would be to, again, shop around after deciding exactly what you wish to gain from the card.

Have a look at www.vadim.co.uk or www.scan.co.uk Nice selection on both these sites, especially Vadim.

If you're not gaming, i wouldn't worry too much about upgrading immediately. The chipset included on the motherboard is ATI's newest, and for an integrated solution it's rather powerful so should have no problem (with the 2gb ram you spec'd) running the Aero feature contained within Vista.

Let me know how you get on, and if you need further assistance you know where to find me. :)

[thwapy]

Hi Alex,

I went to buy the wireless card you recommended, however the shop says this is not compatible with windows VISTA. Any ideas what card would be?? Ordered the system this morning, I hope we have made the right choice !

Also any ideas on a set of 2.1 speakers, I was thinking Logitech x-230 or Altec Lensing VS2321......

[alex]

Originally Posted by thwapy

Hi Alex,

I went to buy the wireless card you recommended, however the shop says this is not compatible with windows VISTA. Any ideas what card would be?? Ordered the system this morning, I hope we have made the right choice !

Also any ideas on a set of 2.1 speakers, I was thinking Logitech x-230 or Altec Lensing VS2321......

I checked the compatability of the W/card prior to posting due to Vista being rather new and Linksys tech support stated it is. Quite worrying you're getting two stories there.

Lemme have a dig and i'll come back to you on that.

With regards to the speakers. The Logitech set is £30, controls conveniently located. Wall mountable and a 2 year warranty.

The Altec's are around £45, 1 year warranty, controls again located conveniently. Good frequency range but aesthetically speaking they aren't as good. Still, thats personal preference, you may disagree.

Dunno, much of a muchness to be frank. If it was me? I'd save £15 and go for the Logitech's.